In this episode of Practicing Love, Shana James is joined by Erotic Wholeness Guide Darshana Avila, whose work has been featured on Netflix’s Sex, Love & goop, The Guardian, The New Yorker, and more. Together, they explore an expanded understanding of eroticism — not as performance or sexuality alone, but as the life force energy of Eros that supports your creativity, intimacy, passion, and aliveness.
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Reclaim Eros: Erotic Intelligence for Deeper Love, Intimacy, and Vitality: Show Notes
When you start to understand eros, and reclaim it, it becomes a force that enlivens not only the bedroom, but your whole life!
In today’s episode of Practicing Love, I talk with Darshana Avila, an Erotic Wholeness Guide whose work has been featured on Netflix’s Sex, Love & Goop, The Guardian, and The New Yorker. Our conversation is a deep exploration of eros as life force energy, and how reclaiming it can transform intimacy, creativity, and self-connection.
We talk about how many of us were taught to suppress our erotic energy through people-pleasing, perfectionism, and the pressure to perform, especially in sex and relationships. And how that suppression often leads to disconnection, anxiety, and a loss of vitality.
Darshana shares a powerful reframe: erotic wholeness isn’t about fixing or forcing desire. It’s about integrating all parts of ourselves — including grief, shame, and protective strategies — so that our nervous systems can relax enough for pleasure, presence, and intimacy to arise naturally.
Themes we explore in this episode:
- What erotic wholeness (beyond sex) actually means
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How erotic energy fuels creativity, connection, and vitality
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Why expanding our definition of eroticism reduces pressure around sex
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How nervous system regulation supports intimacy and pleasure
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How people-pleasing and perfectionism suppress erotic expression
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What it means to live erotically — creatively, relationally, and honestly
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Why integrating grief, shame, and protective strategies is part of erotic healing
If you want to feel more energy or pleasure in your life, and/or feel more connected to yourself and others, this is a great episode for you. Darshana’s work was beautifully demonstrated on Netflix’s Sex, Love & Goop and I trust the depth and safety of her work.
This episode beautifully complements the work I share in Honest Sex, expanding what’s possible when we stop performing and start listening to our body and truth.
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Transcript:
Shana James (00:01)
Hello and welcome to this episode of Practicing Love. I’m your host, Shana James, and I’m so excited to be here today to talk about a topic near and dear to my heart: eroticism, eros, and the ways that we love—with our bodies, our energy, our hearts, and our souls.
I have an amazing guest here today, Darshana Avila. Darshana is an Erotic Wholeness Guide whose work has been featured on Netflix’s Sex, Love & Goop, The Guardian, The New Yorker, and numerous podcasts. She’s an incredible resource and someone I trust deeply, and I’m very excited to learn from her. We’re in for a treat.
Thank you so much, Darshana, for being here.
Darshana Avila (00:46)
I’m so happy to be here, Shana.
Shana James (00:49)
Yes, yes. Can you give us a sense of what erotic wholeness is, and how you define eroticism?
Darshana Avila (00:58)
Absolutely. Eroticism—for me, and this isn’t my original definition, I want to be clear about that—but as I’ve come to understand eros, it’s more synonymous with life force energy, our vitality, that animating force within us.
Eros is absolutely present in our sexuality, but it’s also present in our creativity, our art, our activism—anything and everything we’re passionate about. It’s present in how we tend relationships of all sorts.
I think a lot of us hear the word erotic and associate it with something very specific. It’s almost like a version of sex that’s extra provocative. We use the word erotica to describe literature or prose that’s very sex-forward.
Shana James (01:37)
Like it has to be sex.
Darshana Avila (01:54)
Exactly. And what’s interesting is that eroticism is actually much bigger than most of us give it credit for. And yet, the word itself is complicated. Sex is a complicated word.
I love having these conversations because when we define eroticism and widen the lens of what it can be, it creates more spaciousness for that creative force. The pressure we tend to put on sex—how heavy the topic can feel—starts to ease.
And obviously, intimacy matters. You wouldn’t be listening to this podcast if you didn’t care about your intimate life. But this invites a more expansive relationship with our erotic nature—our erotic energy—and how it shows up in our intimate lives.
Shana James (02:32)
No, I love this. This feels so aligned.
In my book Honest Sex, I talk about what sex actually is, and how to expand it beyond genitals, penetration, or the usual definitions. I love that this conversation expands it even further—that eros isn’t just in the bedroom, or even just in our bodies or sex lives. It’s this animating life force.
Darshana Avila (03:10)
Yes. A real-time example: I saw a performance this past weekend by a dance company called Momix. They do these incredible performance art pieces—dance, movement, visual spectacle.
I came out of the theater and thought, That was such an erotic experience. And by that I mean every one of my senses was firing. I was dancing in my seat the whole time. I couldn’t contain the aliveness in my body. I was gasping, squealing—things you might associate with sex.
And I was sitting in a theater, fully clothed, holding hands with my partner. It wasn’t sexual—but it was sensual. It was enlivening. It brought up emotion and sensation that felt almost impossible to contain.
Shana James (04:01)
Mm-hmm.
Darshana Avila (04:04)
So that’s an example of eroticism in a completely non-sexual context. And when we give examples like that, most people can relate. We’ve all had moments in life where that pulsing energy moves through us and we can’t stop it.
Shana James (04:38)
Can’t stop it. And that also speaks to how we’re so conditioned to contain our excitement, our joy, our energy—and the impact that has on romance, intimacy, parenting, and all our relationships.
Darshana Avila (04:45)
Yes, very much so. Suppressing this vital force does us a massive disservice in all our relating.
It plays into cultural patterns that are normalized but deeply problematic—people-pleasing, performative sex, perfectionism. These adaptive strategies distance us from our most authentic expression.
We suppress what’s real and alive in us in order to be “good,” “polite,” or “right.” And these strategies make sense—we adapt to get love, connection, and safety.
So if anyone listening recognizes themselves in this, the last thing I want is for you to feel shame. Most of us do this. What I want to invite is awareness—and the realization that we have a choice to dismantle these strategies in favor of a more authentic expression of self.
In my experience—both personally, for over 40 years, and professionally, in private practice for over a decade—I have yet to meet a person who hasn’t benefited from expanding their erotic expression.
Shana James (06:27)
Yeah. Yeah.
Can we make this more concrete? What do people actually come to you for? Because most people don’t say, “My eros is dulled.” What brings them in?
Darshana Avila (06:38)
Sure. Most often it’s sex- or intimacy-related.
On one end of the spectrum, there’s known trauma—something blocked in the nervous system. People may not feel available for sex, or they’re enduring it, dissociating through it. In those cases, we start with trauma remediation to make exploration possible.
For others, sex is okay, but there’s a sense that it could be so much better—that ineffable something more. Often that’s about presence in the body and widening what’s possible.
As you mentioned in your book, many of us define sex very narrowly, based on cultural scripts. Regardless of gender or orientation, when we say sex, people often think penis-in-vagina intercourse. And we’re taught there’s an escalator—you get on it, and the only way off is ejaculation, and then it’s over.
Shana James (07:47)
So narrowly. Yes.
Darshana Avila (08:04)
That’s incredibly limiting for everyone involved. So people come to me wanting to expand what sex can be—to cultivate sustainable intimacy, whether they’re partnered or hoping to be.
For others, it’s about giving permission to deeper desires—kink, passion, curiosity—parts of themselves that haven’t had space to express. And it makes sense to seek guidance here. We seek expertise in so many areas of life—why not this one?
Shana James (09:04)
Why not this? It’s so important.
Because we’ve had such limited education or exposure to what erotic aliveness can be, there’s often a deficit. People are fumbling around without guidance, and that can create so much pain.
Darshana Avila (09:40)
I’m laughing because I say that all the time—fumbling around in the dark. Regardless of age, many of us are overgrown teenagers when it comes to sex, because our understanding hasn’t matured beyond adolescence.
We don’t get education. What passes for sex education is dismal. And often people come from religious or political conservatism, which narrows things further. Then the pendulum swings, and they want to reclaim everything that was withheld. And I say yes—we all deserve that.
Shana James (10:47)
We do. Absolutely.
Many of my clients come from similar backgrounds. And on top of not being educated about sex, most of us weren’t taught about emotions or how to communicate vulnerability. When you mix all that together, even loving relationships can become a mess.
So let’s go back to erotic wholeness. How would you know if someone is erotically whole?
Darshana Avila (11:30)
Great question.
I’ve already defined eroticism, so let me talk about wholeness. For most of us, wholeness is about undoing a lifetime of compartmentalizing—carving pieces of ourselves off and storing them away.
Wholeness is what happens when we begin to gather those parts back together—
Shana James (11:43)
Okay. Great.
Darshana Avila (12:05)
…and gather everything back to ourselves and say, Okay—my grief has a place here. My shame has a place here. My protective strategies have a place here. I just don’t want them driving. They’ve served a purpose.
So when I use the word holistic, yes—mind, body, spirit. And it also means really going into our psyche. Going into all the ways we’ve been scheming and strategizing our way through life, often unconsciously or subconsciously. None of this is—
Shana James (12:11)
Mm.
Darshana Avila (12:28)
—about judgment. It’s about seeing clearly.
Shana James (12:38)
And believing that some of those parts won’t be loved, can’t be loved, can’t be seen.
Darshana Avila (12:43)
Right. Exactly.
And the reality is—we are intrinsically lovable. Even our most troubling acting-out behaviors. Even the things we might pathologize. We are fundamentally lovable. That’s my belief, anyway. You don’t have to agree with me, but I will die on that hill.
Shana James (13:03)
Yeah, I agree. I love the word intrinsic.
I’ve actually been looking for that word recently. We’re intrinsically lovable even when we weren’t taught that, or weren’t treated that way.
Darshana Avila (13:14)
Yes. And we’re not taught that—implicitly or explicitly—because we live in a dominant culture that fetishizes divisiveness and othering in every possible way.
We’re having this conversation in a moment of intense political and social polarization—so much us versus them. And we internalize that with ourselves.
So to choose wholeness is to say: Yeah, I do this thing that’s kind of shitty sometimes. Oof. That’s embarrassing. And—I’m lovable anyway. I love myself anyway. I want you to love me anyway.
That is profoundly intimacy-building.
Shana James (14:05)
“And I’m lovable anyway.” Yes.
Darshana Avila (14:15)
So when you put together eroticism—as this expansive vital life force—and wholeness, what you get is someone who is integrated, grounded, open, and available.
Shana James (14:17)
Yes.
Darshana Avila (14:40)
Someone connected to their body, connected to their heart. Someone who can recognize when judgments or protective strategies are at play—and who has enough nervous system and internal resource to rein that in.
This is not about being perfect 24/7. This is my body of work and I’m not perfect. What I am is accountable. I can name when I’m not at my best. I can express my needs, desires, and boundaries with far more precision than younger versions of myself ever could.
If you’re in relationship with me, I can tell you what’s going on. I can ask for help.
These skills are essential for creating safety, intimacy, pleasure, and enjoyment in our sex lives—but they also translate to absolutely every other area of life. That’s another nod to wholeness. It’s not just about the bedroom. It’s everywhere.
Shana James (15:45)
Yes. I completely agree.
What happens in the bedroom can be a very concrete way to see dynamics that are more subtle elsewhere. But like you’re saying—it applies everywhere.
And I love this idea that someone can show up with all of their parts—even the ones where they say, “That wasn’t my best.” Instead of disappearing into shame, they can come back to their partner and say, I’d like a do-over. I want to treat you better than that. I lost it for a moment.
That’s wholeness.
Darshana Avila (16:47)
Yes. And this really brings us to the nervous system.
I want to talk about nervous system capacity and nervous system tone. We hear the phrase “regulated nervous system,” and many people think that means being calm all the time.
Shana James (17:12)
That’s such an important distinction.
Darshana Avila (17:15)
A well-regulated nervous system means you can activate when appropriate. You can be assertive, dynamic, expressive. And if there’s real threat, fight or flight can come online appropriately.
We’re encoded this way for a reason.
The other side is being able to settle—be receptive, relaxed—when circumstances support that. When that capacity isn’t there, we go into freeze, collapse, or fawn.
And fawn is especially relevant in intimacy. Any time we’re people-pleasing, perfectionistic, or performing in relationship, we’re fawning. We’re not being authentic.
Now, the benevolent side of fawn is what’s called tend-and-befriend, often associated with the female nervous system. It’s relational wisdom—How do I cultivate connection to diffuse threat?
That can be wise and appropriate.
Shana James (18:59)
Right.
Darshana Avila (19:04)
But there’s a limit. There’s a cost.
If compromise becomes self-erasure—if you’re enduring or tolerating things you wouldn’t choose—that’s a problem. And many of us have this problem. Some of us know it.
Shana James (19:34)
Yeah. All genders, too—just expressed differently.
How do you support people in coming back to wholeness when they realize, Oh, I’m performing. I’m pleasing. I’m trying to be perfect?
Darshana Avila (19:54)
I frame my work as a personal intimacy laboratory. Everything we do is an experiment—one big experiment with many smaller ones inside it.
So we explore: What happens if you don’t perform? What happens if from the beginning we tend to a few foundational things that create a different set of circumstances?
Shana James (20:06)
I love that.
Darshana Avila (20:23)
First, we work with the nervous system from day one. Learning to go up when you need to go up, and come down when you need to come down. That’s the foundation beneath everything I do.
And these are skills people practice out in the wild—in their actual lives.
Shana James (20:42)
Are there a few main practices you could name, just so people have a reference point?
Darshana Avila (20:48)
Yes. I draw heavily from Somatic Experiencing, which I’m certified in, and NeuroAffective Touch.
Both are body-led modalities that help identify patterns of dysregulation and unsafety—and support the completion of trauma response cycles that never finished.
And there are also very simple tools. I’m feeling off-center—can I feel my feet? Can I track my breath? Can I name one thing I see, hear, feel?
Pragmatic tools on one end, and deeper facilitated work on the other—where I’m essentially lending my regulated nervous system to my clients.
Shana James (21:55)
Yes. That’s so profound.
Those tools are simple and incredibly effective. And I love how you name the bigger picture too—how unfinished trauma leaves people walking around like live wires.
Your work helps complete those cycles so people can actually feel safer in their bodies.
Darshana Avila (22:27)
Yes. Thank you.
And another foundational element is Betty Martin’s Wheel of Consent. I don’t give people a master’s degree in it, but we go deep enough to dismantle power dynamics—especially in the practitioner-client relationship.
We get transparent about power so clients can recognize how it shows up everywhere else in their lives, too.
Shana James (23:22)
…in their own relationships.
Darshana Avila (23:26)
And the key difference between Betty Martin’s work and what many people understand consent to be is that consent is often thought of very simply—you say yes, therefore you’re consenting.
But we want to look at this much more granularly. Whatever we’re about to do—who is it for? Whose desire is motivating it?
So I can consent to doing something for you that you ask for.
Shana James (23:45)
Mmm. Interesting.
Darshana Avila (23:56)
Let’s use us as a real-time example. If you say, “Hey Darshana, would you rub my shoulders right now?” and I say, “Yes, I care about you, I want to make you feel good,” and I rub your shoulders in the way you want—this is a consensual dynamic.
But let’s say, as I’m rubbing your shoulders, I decide to start running my fingers through your beautiful head of hair. I just flipped the dynamic.
Now I’m doing something for me that you didn’t explicitly consent to. You might like it, you might not—but the point is, the motivation shifted.
Shana James (24:07)
Yeah. Sure. Okay.
Darshana Avila (24:23)
So we get very granular about: Who is the doer? Who is being done to? Whose desire is driving the exchange? How are we attending to boundaries on either side?
It’s more nuanced than just yes or no. And when we get this granular, it’s like training wheels on a bike. You need them at first—so eventually, you can coast without them.
Shana James (25:05)
Yes. Yes.
Darshana Avila (25:20)
We go into these deep definitions of how consent is established so you don’t have to check in about every tiny thing. That’s another place people get confused — thinking consent means asking permission for absolutely everything.
The intention there is good — we want to be respectful. And we also need room for spontaneity. Many of us want to feel our partner’s leadership, their desire for us. It’s nuanced.
Shana James (25:33)
Yes. Exactly.
Darshana Avila (25:48)
So I spend a lot of time here with clients—so they can take this understanding into the wilds of their relational lives.
Shana James (25:54)
What would you say this actually does for people?
I’ve done some of Betty Martin’s work, and I love it—especially the simplicity of the Three Minute Game and how it separates these pieces. For someone who hasn’t done this work, what does it offer a couple who already loves each other? Who has technically “consented” already?
Darshana Avila (26:41)
What’s helpful—especially for established couples—is that chances are, you’re following a particular choreography or script around intimacy.
And chances are also good that one or both of you doesn’t actually like parts of it—but you’re going along with it.
Shana James (26:50)
Yes. Exactly. I’m not satisfied.
Darshana Avila (27:05)
Right. And often you assume the other person does like it, so you keep your mouth shut.
This work creates space for curiosity and meaningful communication around what you actually want to do to each other, with each other, for each other.
So maybe you’ve been giving your partner blowjobs forever because you think that’s how sex must begin. And meanwhile, your partner is thinking, Oral isn’t actually my favorite thing.
I’m riffing here — but we make a lot of assumptions when we’ve been doing things the same way for a long time. And we forget: How did we even start this choreography?
Shana James (28:03)
Yeah. And it can be scary to talk about — because you don’t want to rock the boat.
Or you worry, If I say this, they’ll think everything’s been fake for ten years. Which is usually not true — there’s nuance — but it can feel terrifying.
Darshana Avila (28:20)
Totally.
And that brings us to another core piece of erotic wholeness: communication skills. Empowering your voice.
Learning that you can introduce a conversation that will feel vulnerable. You might be awkward. And — that’s okay.
Shana James (28:47)
Yes. One of my favorite parts. That it’s okay.
Darshana Avila (28:59)
What many of us are trying to avoid is disappointing or shaming our partner.
There’s this fear that if I express a desire for something different, my partner will hear, I don’t like having sex with you.
But framing makes all the difference.
If you say, “Our sex life just isn’t doing it for me,” that’s going to land as judgment.
If you say, “I care so much about our intimacy. You’re precious to me. We’ve grown in so many ways, and I feel like there’s more growth available here. Would you be open to exploring that with me?” —that’s an invitation.
Shana James (29:35)
Yes. And there’s more I want to explore.
Huge difference.
Darshana Avila (29:56)
Exactly. Invitation instead of criticism.
And this applies whether you’re newly dating, married for 30 years, or anywhere in between. There’s always possibility.
Shana James (30:17)
I love that.
I often talk about how complaint and desire are two sides of the same coin. You can complain — and usually not get what you want. Or you can name desire.
I also have couples debrief sex afterward. Instead of saying, “That didn’t work for me,” they say, “Here’s what worked. Here’s what I want more of.” That framing invites receptivity and play.
Darshana Avila (31:13)
Yes. Growth and play — these are beautiful qualities to bring to intimacy.
Many of us drift far from that. We’re following the same script, the same choreography.
There is more — if we’re willing to risk vulnerability. And I say “risk” intentionally.
Saying I want more doesn’t mean I don’t like what we have. It means: Would you like to explore this with me?
Shana James (31:52)
Such a beautiful thing.
Thank you. This has been incredible. Is there anything you wish you’d said—or something you want to leave people with?
Darshana Avila (32:02)
There’s always more — but this feels like a really good sampler.
And I always want to say: if you heard anything today and used it as a weapon against yourself — please don’t.
We are all figuring this out. Most of us didn’t get the education, modeling, or support we needed. So of course it’s messy sometimes.
Choosing to move toward more — that’s what builds skills over time and makes this all feel less awkward, more easeful.
I hope this feels like a seed of inspiration. A gentle nudge toward your growth — and toward your pleasure. Because that is available to you.
Shana James (33:16)
One thing I really appreciate about you is how you take this vast, vulnerable topic and communicate it so clearly and grounded.
I see this in Betty Martin’s work too — there can be structure without passion, and passion without structure. But the sweet spot is both.
So we can let go into flow and know we’re safe, held, and able to check in. I feel that in how you speak about this.
Darshana Avila (34:00)
100%. Thank you so much for that reflection.
Shana James (34:04)
Where can people find you?
Darshana Avila (34:08)
You can find me at my website, darshanaavila. com. That’s the best jumping-off point.
I work with clients all over the U.S. and internationally. I offer deep-dive immersions — kind of like your own Sex, Love & Goop experience from Netflix. I also have online courses and a free community called Galgazm, with a library of resources.
I’m also on Instagram and YouTube. And I genuinely love hearing from people — so if you heard me here, please feel free to reach out.
Shana James (34:49)
Great, thank you. Thank you so much for being here.
Darshana Avila (34:52)
My pleasure.
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